Iminsi ine irashize Ingabo za Leta Zunze Ubumwe za Amerika hamwe n’iza Israel zitangije ibitero simusiga kuri Iran ishinjwa umugambi wo gushaka gukora intwaro za nucléaire. Ni ibitero byatumye intambara ikwira mu Burasirazuba bwo hagati, kuko Iran yihimuye irasa ku bihugu bituranye bikorana na Amerika.
Uretse impfu n’ibikorwaremezo byangijwe mu gihe gito ibi bitero bimaze, byagize ingaruka no ku bukungu kuko ingendo z’indege nyinshi zahagaze, ibiciro by’ibikomoka kuri peteroli bitangira kuzamuka, ndetse kugeza ubu hari byinshi abantu bibaza birimo impamvu z’ibi bitero, igihe bizarangirira n’icyo bivuze kuri politike mpuzamahanga.
Mu kiganiro IGIHE yagiranye na Ambasaderi wa Israel mu Rwanda, Einat Weiss, yasubije bimwe muri ibi bibazo benshi bibaza.
IGIHE: Ko hari ibiganiro hagati ya Amerika na Iran ku buhuza bwa Oman, kandi byatangaga icyizere ni iki cyatumye hafatwa icyemezo cyo gutera Iran?
Amb. Weiss: Igihe cyo gutera cyashingiye no kuri ibi biganiro twumvaga ko Iran iri gusetamo ibirenge, igafata umwanya munini kugira ngo ibiganiro bikomeze, ariko ari ukuyobya uburari nk’aho iri mu biganiro, ku rundi ruhande amakuru y’ubutasi agaragaza ko batari kongera kubaka ubushobozi bwabo mu bijyanye n’ibisasu kirimbuzi bya misile, ahubwo bari no guhisha ibyo bisasu bya misile ndetse na gahunda yabo yo gukora intwaro za nucléaire, bikorewe mu buvumo. Hashingiwe ku makuru y’ubutasi byagaragaye ko bari gukomeza ibyo, mu gihe bari no mu biganiro, birumvikana ko cyari ikimenyetso cy’umuburo.
Icya kabiri ni uko no mu gihe baganiraga, ubuyobozi bwa Iran bwahisemo gukandamiza Abanya-Iran, baburizamo ikimenyetso cyose cy’imyigaragambyo. Mu gihe twaganiraga twabonye ko hari ukubusanya hagati y’ibyo bavuga n’ibiri kuba by’ukuri.
Intego y’ibi bitero ni iyihe, by’umwihariko kuri Israel n’abafatanyabikorwa banyu ba Amerika? Ese mubona iyi ntambara izarangira vuba?
Birasaba ko nsubira inyuma gato, kugira ngo humvikane intego y’iki gitero. Ubutegetsi bwa Iran bumaze hafi imyaka 50 ku butegetsi, uhereye ku mpinduramatwara yo mu 1979. Kuva bafata ubutegetsi kugeza uyu munsi bahisemo inzira y’iterabwoba.
Tugarutse ku ntego, hari nke dufite. Iya mbere ni uguhagarika ibitero by’iterabwoba bya Iran kuri Israel, guhagarika ibikorwa bya Iran bikomeje kugeragezwa byo guhanagura burundu igihugu cya Israel kuko ni yo ntego ikomeye ya Iran, ndetse no guhagarika ibikorwa byo gushyigikira imitwe y’iterabwoba.
Wibuke ko ejo hashize mu gihe Iran yarasaga misile kuri Israel, umutwe wa Hezbollah na wo wahise ubyinjiramo. Hezbollah ni umutwe ufashwa na Iran.
Icya mbere dushaka ni ukugerageza gukura iki kibazo mu buzima bwacu burundu. Nta gihugu gikwiriye kubana n’ikibazo nk’iki by’iteka.
Icya kabiri ni ugufasha abaturage ba Iran bigaragambije mu byumweru byinshi bishize, basaba Isi kubafasha, bagahabwa amahirwe yo guhitamo ahazaza habo. Ntekereza ko Uburasirazuba bwo Hagati bwababaye bikomeye kubera intego zikomeje za Iran zo gushaka kuyobora akarere, gutegura ibitero by’iterabwoba.
Navuga ko intego ya mbere ari ugukuraho ibi byago byose, kugira ngo mu Burasirazuba bwo Hagati hazarangwe n’ituze mu bihe biri imbere.
Twabonye Iran isubiza mu buryo bukomeye ibi bitero, ni ibintu mwari mwiteze?
Yego cyane, twari twize ko Iran izasubiza, ibyo twarabibonye no muri Kamena 2025. Wibuke ko kuva muri Kamena kugeza mu mpera za Gashyantare n’intangiriro za Werurwe 2026, ubwo ibitero byatangiraga, ubukungu bwa Iran bwarashegeshwe cyane, ariko hejuru y’ibyo bashyizeho gahunda yo gukora misile za rutura, ibyo twarabibonye uko byagiye byiyubaka kandi twari tuzi ko nibagera mu byago ibyo ari byo byose bazarasa mu buryo butarobanura. Wibuke kandi ko Umuyobozi w’Ikirenga yishwe mu bitero bya mbere bya Israel na Amerika, ku bw’ibyo twari tuzi neza ko bazasubiza.
Ariko kuri icyo hari ibyo nshaka kuvuga. Ntekereza ko igihe kigeze ngo Isi muri rusange ihagarike uburyarya iyo bigeze kuri Israel. Kubera ko mu gihe Israel ihisemo kurwanya ubutegetsi bwa Iran, nubwo bishoboka ko habaho kwangirika kw’ibindi, intego ya Israel ni ubutegetsi bwa Iran n’ibikorwa by’iterabwoba; Iran yo ku rundi ruhande irasa ku bushake ibice bituwemo n’abantu.
Impamvu hari umubare muto w’abaguye mu bitero bya Iran by’ejo hashize, kuko abaturage icyenda nibo bishwe na misile rutura za Iran, ni uko twubahiriza amategeko atangwa na Guverinoma, buri gihe iyo hari misile yoherejwe tujya mu bwihisho, ndetse tubikesha n’ikoranabuhanga twubatse mu myaka myinshi ishize ripfubya ibisasu. Iyo biba bitameze gutya haba harapfuye benshi kubera ko Iran yohereje ibisasu mu bice bituwe cyane muri Tel Aviv, ntacyo bitaho yaba Abarabu b’Abayisilamu, abakirisitu, bo barohereza gusa.
Navuga ko itandukaniro rihari ugereranyije no muri Kamena, ni uko ubu batangiye kohereza misile mu Burasirazuba bwo Hagati bwose, muri Leta Zunze Ubumwe z’Abarabu, Bahrain ndetse no muri Cyprus nk’uko twabibonye ejo hashize.
Twavuga ngo ingaruka z’ibitero bya Iran kuri Israel zingana gute?
Ntabwo ari ibintu bishya, abaturage bahora bajya mu bwihisho cyangwa bakabuvamo kenshi, ariko abaturage ba Israel bagaragaje kudacika intege mu myaka myinshi ishize, ibya vuba ubwo ni ukuva ku wa 27 Ukwakira. Kuri iyi nshuro na bwo nta tandukaniro rihari cyane. Ni byo hari ibyangiritse, ariko na none hashimwe ikoranabuhanga nka Iron Dome n’irindi rishya riri kuvuka, kuko twabashije gupfubya misile nyinshi. Ibyo ni muri rusange, ariko misile imwe iducitse ishobora kwangiza byinshi.
Hari ibyangiritse muri Tel Aviv no mu bindi bice, mu ntambara buriya nta ijana ku ijana ribaho.
Navuga ko kuri twe uko tubona ibintu, kujya muri iyi ntambara na Iran ni ibintu bibabaje, ariko kutajya muri iyi ntambara na Iran tukiyicarira byazaba bibabaje inshuro 1000 mu myaka iri imbere. Iyo uri umuyobozi w’igihugu ibyo byose urabireba, ukagereranya ibyiza n’ibibi.
Ambasaderi Weiss yavuze ko kuba Iran yarabasubije atari ibintu byatunguranye
Umuyobozi w’Ikirenga wa Iran yapfuye ku munsi wa mbere w’igitero, hari icyo byaba byarahinduye ku kibazo gihari?
Ntekereza ko ntaba umuvugizi w’ubutegetsi bwa Iran, ariko ibyo twabonye ni uko ari ikintu gihambaye cyagezweho kuri Israel na Amerika.
Reka ngusubize inyuma gato nanone, ntabwo ari Umuyobozi w’Ikirenga gusa wari ugambiriwe muri ibi bitero, hari abandi bantu bo hafi ye bari bagambiriwe.
Mu nama ebyiri zayobowe n’Umuyobozi w’Ikirenga n’abandi bantu be ba hafi baganiriye ku buryo bwo kurushaho gukandamiza abaturage ba Iran, ubwo byabaga (yicwaga) ku Banya-Iran bashatse gusubiza, kohereza misile mu Burasirazuba bwo Hagati, bakomeje ibitero ndetse bashaka ku byongerera imbaraga ibyo twarabibonye.
Ariko twabashije (Israel na Amerika) gucunga umutekano w’ikirere, n’ibitero byacu muri Iran, kuko Iran ni igihugu kinini cyane, Israel n’u Rwanda byakwirwa muri Iran inshuro nyinshi. Ibyo nibyo duhanganye na byo.
Iyo mutabona ubu bufasha bwose bwa Amerika, ese mwari kwishoboza iki gitero?
Ntekereza ko iki kibazo cyari kubazwa mu buryo bwiza, tuvuze ngo ‘ni gute ibikorwa bya gisirikare Amerika ihuriyeho na Israel byabayeho’.
Igihe cyose twagiye tugirana ubufatanye bwa buri munsi, dusangira amakuru y’ubutasi, dufatanya mu bya politike, ubufatanye bwa gisirikare. Twagiye tubona ibikorwa bya gisirikare biturutse mu bushake dusangiye, bwo kurushaho kugira Isi nziza no kumva uburemere bw’ikibazo Iran iteje Isi.
Israel kuva yabaho mu 1948 yagaragaje ko ifite kimwe mu bisirikare biyoboye ibindi mu bushobozi, ubushobozi mu by’ubutasi. Ntabwo dufite ubwoba bwo kwirwanaho no gufata ingamba zigamije kurinda igihugu cyacu.
Imwe mu mpamvu Iran yatewe ni uko ishinjwa umugambi wo gukora intwaro za nucléaire, kuki mudashaka ko izitunga kandi mwe muzifite?
Reka duhere ku mpamvu. Birababaje kuba ufite umunyamuryango wa Loni umaze imyaka 50, uvuga atihishe, kuri misile ze ndetse agashimangira ko ashaka gusenya burundu ikindi gihugu, aricyo Israel. Baravuga bati urupfu kuri Israel, urupfu kuri Amerika. Ufite igihugu kiri kwihuta mu buryo butarabaho mu gukora intwaro za nucléaire, kandi bakabivuga mu ruhame ko bashaka gutunga intwaro za nucléaire kugira ngo basenye ikindi gihugu, uyu ni umuburo ukomeye udakwiriye kureberwa. Ntabwo bashaka gutunga nucléaire ku mpamvu za gisivile, ntabwo bazishaka kugira ngo birinde, ahubwo bazishaka ngo bateze intambara.
Impamvu Israel yaburiye Isi mu myaka myinshi ishize, ni uko ibikangisho byigaragazaga kandi bari bari kubaka ubushobozi mu bya nucléaire, binyuranyije n’icyifuzo mpuzamahanga. Barabeshyaga mu byo babaga barimo, izi ntwaro bazihishaga ahantu hatandukanye.
Mu kumva neza ibyo bashakaga kugeraho ni uko bari bagambiriye kubona igisasu kimwe cyagera i Londres, gishobora kugera muri Afurika ndetse gishobora kugira no muri Amerika. Igihugu gifite ibi bintu n’uyu mugambi gikwiriye kwamaganwa ndetse kigakurwa mu muryango mpuzamahanga, aho guhabwa ikaze na bimwe mu bihugu biri muri uyu muryango mpuzamahanga.
Ambasaderi Weiss yavuze ko Iran igambiriye gusiba burundu Israel ku ikarita y'Isi
Benshi mu Banyarwanda barahangayitse, ese bagenzi babo bari muri Israel bafite umutekano?
Buri mujyi muri Israel, buri munyamahanga uri muri Israel afite uburyo bwo kugira aho yahungira, kandi ubutumwa buburira buri gihe buba ari ukuri. Nibumvira ubutumwa buburira ndetse n’impuruza zitangwa ndetse bakihisha, bazaba bafite umutekano.
Icya kabiri mu kubakomeza navuga ni uko dufite icyizere ko intego (z’ibitero) zizagerwaho vuba, nemera ko nitugera ku ntego bazabaho neza by’igihe kirekire, kurenza uko bimeze uyu munsi.
Navuga ko muri rusange Abanyarwanda bumva neza ibiri kuba kandi ni abantu badacika intege. Mu gihe ikirere kizaba gifunguwe, ndabizi abantu bashaka gutaha no kujya muri Israel, kandi ndabizi ni vuba.
Ese haba hari ibiganiro mwagiranye n’ubuyobozi bw’u Rwanda, ku mutekano w’Abanyarwanda bari muri Israel?
Hari ibiganiro biri kuba n’abayobozi b’u Rwanda ndetse na Guverinoma. Ni ibiganiro bibaho buri munsi, dufite imikoranire myiza na Guverinoma, ndetse mu gihe haba hari impungenge ndahari kugira ngo mbikemure, kugeza ubu nta mpungenge ikomeye twari twumva.
Ese mu biganiro mugirana n’abayobozi b’u Rwanda, bahagaze he ku biri kuba?
Icyo ni ikibazo cyiza wabaza abayobozi banyu, aho ku kibaza njye, ariko navuga ko muri rusange dukorana neza na Guverinoma, dukorana neza n’abayobozi. Turaganira mu buryo buhoraho, kandi navuga ko twumva dutekanye hano mu Rwanda.
Ni ibiki muri gukora mu kwirinda ko iyi ntambara ifata indi ntera
Reka nsubiremo gato bimwe mu byo nari navuze. Dufite igihugu gifite ubushobozi bwo kohereza misile zifite ubushobozi bwo kugenda kilometero 2300, zarashwe muri Israel ariko zishobora no kugera mu bihugu biri hirya ya Israel. Zishobora kugera mu bihugu by’Umuryango w’Ubumwe bw’u Burayi, ejo hashize barabyerekanye. Kuki bakeneye misile zishobora kugenda ibilometero 2300, iki ni ikibazo cya mbere cyo kwibaza? Niba ushyize imbere imibereho myiza y’igihugu cyawe, kuki uri gushyira miliyari ibihumbi z’amadolari mu gukora izi misile?
Twemera ko iki ari igihe ku baturage ba Iran cyo gufata mu biganza ahazaza habo. Icya mbere ni uko twashyizeho uburyo buzatuma ibyo bishoboka. Ikindi ni uko biri mu nshingano za Iran guhagarika kurasa misile ku bindi bihugu, kugira ngo yirinde ko intambara igera kure, ntabwo nshaka kumenya impamvu bari kubikora kuko bitari mu nshingano zanjye, ariko icyo mbona ni uko Iran ishaka kuzana Isi yose muri iyi ntambara[…].
Mu by’ukuri iki kibazo gikwiriye kubazwa Iran, kuki bakomeje kwagura intambara aho gusubiza gusa Israel, ku rundi ruhande ariko nta n’ubwo bari gusubiza ubutegetsi bwa Israel, bari kurasa abasivili.
Ambasaderi Weiss yavuze ko Abanyarwanda bari muri Israel batekanye igihe cyose bakurikiza amabwiriza atangwa na Leta
